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  • msp1976
    02-18 11:28 AM
    This is an excellent analysis of why do you see so many EB based immigrants from India and not from other places...The same arguments can apply almost identically to the Chinese immigrants...

    I have been following your arguments and I get a sense that though not explicitly anti immigrants, you are opposed to any concentration of EB immigrants from any particular place..It just happens so that at this time it happens to be the Indians....
    But a large concentration of Indians in this immigrant category is not an accident....nor is it just because of people preferring their kins for sponsoring....But because of the numerous facts enumerated in this article.....

    Of course you can dismiss this argument as Indians promoting themselves...but what the heck... I have to at least try...

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  • gc_check
    06-15 01:45 PM
    Luck does plays in big role in EB Immigration.

    Prior to PERM, people applied from one of the States that were processing fast got the GC within couple years. People mainly from NY,NJ,CA,TX,OH and few others were those unlucky ones who had to go through back log elimination center with very old PD's. All, dates were current till Dec 31,2004 and most people who were able to get Labor approval prior to date were able to file 485 prior to this date and most got GC's. But BEC was slow in the beginning, they had this 45 day letter, etc... and by the time, labor approvals started from BEC, priority dates were already retrogressed. Still most people if not all got their GC's. They are still a significant numbers with PD's from 01,02 and 03 waiting in EB3 category and a few in EB2. Since late 2000 and 2001 were not a nice year for s/w sector, i believe a greater number of people were forced to change employment and without a approved I-140 they were not able to carry their PD. Also few folks stuck with a pending AOS somehow got lucky in July.

    There are multiple form posts with reference to Oppenheim statements and I quote the link from Murthy website

    I believe the significant % of numbers of pending application in EB2 would be with a PERM labor and all are with PD with March 2005 or later and few with traditional labor process. Assume 90% of applicants with PD earlier than 2003 should have got their GC's and if not will soon. EB3 would have a mix of folks waiting as many people are with PD 2004 or later and when dates were current, none bothered about the category in which GC/ labor was filed. EB3, had not gotten any unused visa from other categories and given the current scenario, it does not look bright either, unless EB2 is current, numbers don't trickle down to EB3 and EB3 ROW itself is in severe demand. I do know few unlucky friends of mine with EB3 PD of 2004 or earlier still waiting to file AOS.

    We all know, till Sept 09, nothing would change. Come Oct 2009, with FY10 visas, at least pre-prem EB2 folks have a better change but for EB3, unless you are 2001 / 2002 chance are very little in FY10 and folks with PD03 and sooner can cautiously bet on FY11, unless there is some congressional intervention, the only option is to wait...

    But if we can get one or two small relief, if not a complete solution to the entire mess, legislative solution like Not counting dependent (On average each primary application consume 2-3 visa numbers based on history), re-capture unused numbers, waive per country limit for n number of years or exclude people with PD older than 5 years and already in US (just an example) or exclude people who already have 40 credits points with SSA (At least these people have contributed to the country significantly ~10 yrs and already consider they are part of this society ) might help.

    Also, lately there seems to be a lot of venting out in the forums rather than having a constructive debate / discussion. Also just talking does not translate to results.

    It is practically not possible for all to be actively involved in works IV core is doing (appreciate them) for various reasons but small or big at the least, a one time contribution from all who have not done so far might help these folks who dedicate their time and energy and result in a relief for all. Change doesn't come @ ease. I am not active either, but from time to time, I try to do the small part I can. Given the dynamic environment we are in, we need to do something today or it is too late.... This forum has 30,000 + members and $10 per individual could translate to 300K that can be put to good use. Nothing is free in this world.

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  • hebbar77
    09-04 06:22 PM

    Don�t assume that things will work like they work in YSR regime.

    If you think that, the discussion does not make any sense to you then keep away. You are assuming that IMV has compromised security. FYI, this is not a YSR forum, nor it his jagir to do a security compromise.

    True facts: I am with you on your thoughts. I feel the same for OUR country.

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  • the_googly
    07-23 01:17 PM
    This does not make sense at all.. cases are a miniscule portion of actual USCIS approvals and a rate of 30 cases per month would mean most of USCIS personnel are on vacation for summer :)

    The assumption is that we have a true random sample on . Please note that the 30 cases per month are not actual cases.. they are cases.


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  • TeddyKoochu
    09-17 03:09 PM
    Yeah that might be true.

    The rate at which 2004 folks are getting approved that probably only 300 applications are left for pre Jan 2005. More approvals augur well for everybody.

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  • NolaIndian32
    09-22 03:55 PM
    Hi Samay,

    I would like to maintain my current H1b status (2nd three-year extension period; I have the approval notice but the visa is not stamped in my passport). I would like to travel to India and return using the Advance Parole document with just my H1b extension approval notice (only first H1b is stamped in the passport).

    1. Can I do this?
    2. Will this change my status from H1b to AOS? When I return from my visit to India, I would like to continue working on my H1b with my current employer. I have not applied for the EAD.

    Please advise.

    Thanks so much!


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  • chi_shark
    09-23 04:52 PM
    I dont think buying a greencard for 100,000$ or for any money is wise. You already are paying enough taxes, paying legal fees.... and of course spending ur prime here waiting for a permanent resident status.
    you are buying a house. they are to give gc in return for us pumping money into the system which otherwise would not have come in

    So let them grant GCs if they feel like. Dont bribe ur way in!!
    its not about their feelings or yours... there is a law and IV is trying to change the law by a legitimate process. do not use words like bribe which refer to improper personal payments for benefits that dont belong.

    Also if one bought a home and then got a GC, lets say he sold the home right after... what abt it....!!
    the new law should decide that... the discussion is open...

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  • hiralal
    06-11 11:04 PM
    your views are correct and analysis looks o.k. too the problem is even the genuine ones get flushed away ..survival of the fittest is not working now at all !!! say a person from worldwide comes in eb3 and say he is just a car mechanic (I know few from south korea who are in this situation) ..they get GC faster than Indian / Chinese EB2 / EB3 applicant (with 10 years experience and good bank balance)
    and Karma means your work / duty and don't worry about results ..we need that ..i.e SEVERAL SMALL Campaigns (since big is not possible now due to members leaving IV / getting dejected that nothing is happening etc etc
    let us not analyze and discuss too much ..we talk a lot and hence the karma that we get is more talk from so called Experts ..lets do numerous small campaigns the very least people will start coming back to IV plus new memberships
    again people are discussing the past and getting stuck in it and my post gets buried ..friends are you listening ??? enough talk !!!!!


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  • mundada
    06-12 05:11 PM
    I hear you buddy but that is what America is and that is what makes America so great. The constant flow of immigrants will always require you to keep upgrading your skills and hence your salary.

    The moment you were forced to enroll in MBA in an effort to upgrade your skills and increase your salary means American model and (comparative advantage) economics are working.

    The same thing happened in agriculture, then manufacturing, and now IT and other industries. It is inevitable!

    By the way, it is not dumping. Here is the real definition of dumping, "the act of a manufacturer in one country exporting a product to another country at a price which is either below the price it charges in its home market or is below its costs of production".

    For your information, I was, am and will most likely continue to be affected by the outsourcing/offshoring/onshoring/immigration/etc.

    I am simply stumped at the level of comprehension of the folks right here. Let me summarize my views as points and hopefully I will get through to you guys

    1. My mention of BITS was not to prove that I was the best and the brightest. It was to prove that my education was NOT subsidized by the govt of India directly or indirectly. Remember passing out of any university doesnt confer the title of the best and the brightest. Unseenguy - If you have kicked the ass of IITians, bitsians etc then consider yourselves genuine. Why this unnecessary trip down "Not confident about myself lane" ?

    2. My mention of MSFT was again not to prove that I am part of the best and rightest. It was to prove that I came here not with the value proposition of low costs but with the value proposition of hardwork and some talent. I did not compromise on my pay or did replace any native employee. Oh BTW I left MSFT in 2000

    3. My mention of the 3 layoffs and my journey was to inform you guys that whatever is happening now is similar to whatever happened in 2001. I wanted to calm down the nerves of the genuine people. Without reading and comprehending the posts, I get responses like that I was an illegal. Remember I was taken back in for 2 days, 485/AP/EAD applied and my jobless days were with my EAD in hand.

    4. One of the reasons, I am against outsourcing companies is that they dump low wage workers. If you guys are aware, every country, including India and US, has anti dumping laws to protect local industries. I am not against offshoring or outsourcing but I am against dumping. Some posters have questioned how I would be affected by all this if I were the among the best and the brightest ? Valid question to a good extent. If you realize that as you age your speed and dexterity at which one adopts newer skills start waning. How long do you think that upgrading skills in a single industry would be possible when you are going to be constantly competing with walmart style options ?

    For now I have chosen to enroll myself in an MBA program and I am hoping that my skills wouldn't be diluted. Think about going to school at age 35 with the responsibility of family and kid. This is my last ditch effort in upgrading my skills because it involves a substantial ownpayment. I am not sure about you guys but a 100K investment for school now is huge for me. The big question is, I am able to pull up my last bit of energy to upgrade now but will it be possible 5 years now if these outsourcing companies starting dumping low cost MBAs ? This is what I meant by my quality of life being impacted. If you guys think that you wouldnt go through the same scenario, then you need some serious retrospection.

    One last thing I would like to point out the inherent contradiction that the current prospective immigrants are facing today. GC is a process that is there to fill in the lack of skills in the US. However with unemployment running close to 10%, the question arises as to whether to train local populace for these skills. There are just 2 exits out of this contradiction

    1. Bring in low cost labor to fulfill this shortage and avoid local training costs
    2. Expand on a new idea. Green seems to be the buzzword today.

    In my opinion, option 1 is lose lose situation for all including the actual foreign employee who provides the services at a low cost. It is the outsourcing company for sure and probably the hiring company that may benefit. The society as a whole loses. Option 2 is an organic option but is laen with the dangers of delays in take off and boom and bust cycles. This is exactly the reason why I suggested that we cut these outsourcing cs from dumping bodies here. I hope I have clarified my opinions lucidly and hopefully look forward to a mature discussion as opposed to name calling, affronts etc.

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  • franklin
    02-13 01:42 PM posted country wise EB visa allocation for the year of 2005. For example, Nepal used only 70 EB3 visas. Whereas country limit is 7%. In that case how EB3 Nepal is retrogressed?

    Can we sue USCIS? Let's discuss.
    In that case, let's hire an attorney.

    There is no such thing as EB3 Nepal, which I'm sure you know. In EB3 ROW, this includes everyone else. I'm sure there are some significant numbers from the UK, Germany, Australian (although they might be separate under E3... not sure), Japan, Tawian.... etc etc the list goes on.

    EB3 ROW doesn't just mean those from tiny countries with tiny populations


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  • kuhelica2000
    02-12 08:21 PM
    Per country limit applies to every country in exactly the same way. It doesn't discriminate between Chad or China. So, how is it discrimination? And think about it- in Olympics soccer/basketball every country can send only one team. Should China and India be allowed to send more teams since they have a larger population? We should try to increase the number of GCs.

    No matter which side you are on, the quota system sucks. Period.

    1) Once you start receiving benefits out of being born in a particular country/ race/ sex/ religion, a notion of "entitlement" quickly builds up within you. This adversely affects your ability to perform, for you just don't have to work hard enough!
    2) If you are punished for being born in a particular country/ race/ sex/ religion, you have no incentive to perform, as you won't get what you deserve no matter how hard you work!

    How about this... during every Olympics, most number of Gold Medals are won by Americans. Now imagine a rule that prevents more than 7% of all Gold Medals going to people born in any one country. How does that sound?

    I will myself hate it if athletes from India (who haven't won anything in the Olympics till date) started winning gold medals simply because other countries cannot receive more than 7%!

    Of course, removing country caps will face opposition, but it should still happen, just because it is the right thing!

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  • STAmisha
    08-31 07:37 AM
    Yes Job market in India is lot hotter than Canada ( IT ) . For that matter it is hotter than US also !!!! But Canada is a 1st world not 3rd world. Once you get that first job in Canada and settle down, there is not much difference between US and Canada in terms of earning and saving potential. There is a short term pain for that INITIAL FIRST job in CANADA, but it is worth it.

    Do what you feel like ( moving to India vs Moving to canada) . Every place has its advanatges , In India, family is a big advantage. But quality of life especially social life really sucks! Canada, you have to consider weather ( it is COLLLLLDDDD in winter ). Do what is best for you

    Also, you mentioned that India has 50 times more jobs than Canada. It is true but the competition is also HUGE . Every teenager now a days does programming course and every second person is an enginneer.

    Good lUck


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  • soljabhai
    12-13 10:43 AM
    Hello All,

    First and foremost, i must thank everyone from IV, who is working tirelessly to resolve the issues of retrogression in the GC process. As an affected individual I am very grateful that leaders of IV are ready to contribute so much effort for its goals. And even though I do not actively work for the IV agenda, I have contributed money to some IV action items.

    I have a question/suggestion regarding the IV agenda. On IV's about page, pt number 2 asserts amongst other things,
    The Discriminatory Per-Country Rationing of Green Cards That Exacerbates the Delays.

    and further in the same point

    We do not allow employers to discriminate hiring based on their nationality or country of origin. Therefore, the employment-based immigration, which is a derivative benefit of employment, should also be free from rationing based on nationality or country of birth.

    I am curious to know what is the "legal" strength of these assertions is. Are they just "moral" statements or can the validity of these statements be tested in the legal framework of this country? In other words, my question is what is the constitutionality of the "Per Country Caps" in Employment / Family Based Immrigration procedures.
    A lot of Laws and Statutes have been challenged in the Judicial System of USA. And many more are challenged every year. And if the laws are not constitutional then they can be repealed.

    I am sure the leaders of IV must have thought about this argument however a quick search of the forums with 'constitutionality' as the search term did not return any results.

    IV's efforts to utilize Lobbying to bring about change to alleviate/eliminate retrogression are certainly beneficial. However, if IV has not already considered and eliminated this legal argument, then it should explore whether there is any substance to this approach.

    Hence this post. Below are some of the links that might be relevant.

    wikipedia article on constitutionality (
    wikipedia category on US immigration case law ( ion_case_law)

    thanks and sincerely,


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  • nojoke
    10-10 04:14 AM
    earlier I was bit skeptical about this idea but now as days it seems to be the only solution ..I knew markets would fall but this is beyond anything :D ...where will dow industrial stop ..I have been trying to buy some stocks but it keeps falling :D ...really worrisome ..but clearing house inventory is definitely the first step ..I don't think world can wait till next year june for home prices to rebound :D
    ...US has to do everything ..and this includes faster GC ..I wonder where core IV is ??
    the magnitude of the problem is too big that they won't even bother to open your letters. your solution is a drop in a bucket. You think they will consider your proposals after no effect from 700 billion bailout and more injection of liquidity around the world and with england, dutch, iceland and most of Europe in even more bigger trouble. Plus 10% market crash in Asia just today. At least let the system settle down a bit before proposing these ideas to the lawmakers.


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  • Openarms
    07-17 10:12 AM
    Dear Attorney,

    I am from India and working as a Software Programmer / Analyst in a decent company and I am using AC21 with this company...and my Green Card journey started September 2002.

    Labor applied (EB3) - September 2002
    Labor approved - July 2003
    I-140 / I-485 applied - December 2003
    I_140 approved - August 2004 after responding to an RFE
    Two times finger prints done and name check is done.
    RFE about sons birth certificate -- responded last year.

    But still the way things are going with Visa numbers and seems no light at the end of the tunnel. I am decided to change EB3 to EB2.

    What would you suggest?

    Where can I find the process for this switch (EB3 to EB2) ??

    Is there any benefit switching from AOS to Consular Process?

    Thanks and appreciate your response.

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  • gc4me
    03-27 08:56 AM
    By Apr 26, if the LC Sub elimination becomes effective, will USCIS reject all pending LC Sub cases (I mean pending I-140, 485 etc using LC Sub) ?
    Any idea, please reply. Or USCIS will continue processing them as usual?


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  • kate123
    09-24 10:35 AM
    I pray for this to happen... we will atleast get EAD and can change jobs....

    I believe that to maintain a steady 485 EB2-I queue the dates should advance fairly fast till maybe the end of 2007 much sooner than September. Following are the reasons, 6 months back probably there were less pre-adjudicated applications so the focus was reviewing and completing these cases, now most of the applications are pre-adjudicated and the route for steady approvals looks clear like what has happened in Sep 2009 for 2004 cases. There will be a time if the spillover happens as many have predicted then most of the cases will get approved and the pre-adjudicated applications will be less or even dry out, so in the letter and spirit I feel that the 485 pipeline should be equally populated at all steps, considering that the 485 approval process is long and has several steps. This year represents great hope for people who missed Jul 07; I guess its time for the next batch to get EAD/AP, I hope Iam not being over optimistic. Feedback and comments welcome for all.

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  • go_guy123
    01-22 02:21 PM
    I pity people who have coming to USA is foremost objective. In my case, i came to USA 7 years ago. Atleast i earned few bucks. But people who are dreaming about USA and taking education loans with the intention to payoff once they land in USA. It also includes people coming here on F1 with intention to work here. I feel really sorry!!!

    Yes very correct. I still don't get the reason for people's obsession of doing MS/MBA in US.
    It makes no sense any more. 10-15 years ago it made sense. I have have been telling people to look outside US for MBA (practiced it myself for my MBA though I did my MS in US)

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  • amulchandra
    01-23 09:29 PM
    This is old link but talks about immigration fraud by some consulting firms.


    05-29 01:03 PM
    Not just limited to Cognizant and some Big 3s(or 2s now).
    Please do not dismiss this as a tunnel vision, its a reality that will develop into a panoramic scam. I know of a guy in India who is sowing seeds of multi-national manager with a Staffing firm(Desi consulting Co) just for this purpose. Worst he has an individual contributor job with some other company that is in collusion with the staffing firm here to prove he works for the company here( I am guessing as a consultant and taxation with a ghost company of US based company in India). I could not get him to spill the beans on how this whole thing is working but he is confident and has sunk a lot of money into it. Strangely, he was disappointed when I told him even with L1A/EB1 it could take 18 to 24 months. Talk about feeling entitled.

    Mind you lot of these guys have registered companies in India already to fish for H1 applicants. We close our eyes on this one, it will break the levees and flood the EB immigration. SO never be coy in dismissing this travesty and mother of all scams that is going to follow.

    I agree. These so called extraordinary EB1 clowns need to get a taste of waiting and suffering period that many others here. I have no problem with a qualified EB1 candidate getting it but EB1 are for extraordinary ability people who really deserve it.

    IT project managers are not the deserving candidate.

    07-26 05:34 PM
    I am not with Amway or Quixtar but I think the folks with Amway/Quixtar are under represented on this thread and it's not fair :-)

    Just to add another dimention to this thread I will play the devil's advocate :D

    Here I go ...

    You guys are all wasting your free time bitching on this thread where as we are spending all our free time growing our business. We will retire early as we would make $xxxx/month for nothing when we turn 40 and dont need to work anymore where as all you guys bitching about Amway / Quixtar will still be working hard at your jobs till 60.

    What's your response ?


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